German Junior 2007

[TheChosenOneReturns!]

German Junior 2007 draw and seedings are out....

http://www.tournamentsoftware.com/sport/tournament.aspx?id=13548

Strong Asian contingent for the headliner European junior ranking event of the year.

How does it all reflect on seedings for next months European Junior Championships....?

British Seedings

Mens Singles...
No Seeds

Womens Singles....
Michelle Cheung (Eng) - 5/8
Linda Sloan (Sco) - 9/16

Mens Doubles
Adcock and Mills (Eng) - 5/8

Ladies Doubles
Agathangelou and White (Eng) - 3/4

Mixed Doubles
Adcock and White (Eng) - 5/8

[Markymark]

German Junior 2007 draw and seedings are out....

http://www.tournamentsoftware.com/sport/tournament.aspx?id=13548

Strong Asian contingent for the headliner European junior ranking event of the year.

How does it all reflect on seedings for next months European Junior Championships....?

British Seedings

Mens Singles...
No Seeds

Womens Singles....
Michelle Cheung (Eng) - 5/8
Linda Sloan (Sco) - 9/16

Mens Doubles
Adcock and Mills (Eng) - 5/8

Ladies Doubles
Agathangelou and White (Eng) - 3/4

Mixed Doubles
Adcock and White (Eng) - 5/8

Michelle and Linda are drawn to meet in the last 16!! Could be very interesting. However, Linda has Iris Beling from the Netherlands in her section, and she lost badly to her in the recent dutch open.

[free]

not a gents singles seed is disappointing for the future

[Markymark]

not a gents singles seed is disappointing for the future

Not really. Junior seedings are often wrong. Chloe Magee is not seeded in the ladies' and she's probably the best junior girl in Britain and Ireland at the moment.

Also, Kieran Merrilees has just got to the quarters of the Dutch, beating the no.3 seed in the process.

[TheChosenOneReturns!]

It makes you wonder how they construct the junior rankings, and if the seedings here are an indication of seedings in next months European Juniors.

According to the Experts previous post (other thread) Chloe Magee will likely be top seed for the European Junior, but then why is she not even seeded here..?

Both Michelle and Linda taking seeded spots above her.

Are the Junior seedings compiled a lot on subjectivity?

[Markymark]

It makes you wonder how they construct the junior rankings, and if the seedings here are an indication of seedings in next months European Juniors.

According to the Experts previous post (other thread) Chloe Magee will likely be top seed for the European Junior, but then why is she not even seeded here..?

Both Michelle and Linda taking seeded spots above her.

Are the Junior seedings compiled a lot on subjectivity?

And linda is no.1 on the european junior circuit and has a higher world ranking than Michelle but is seeded below her. I think they just make it up.

[free]

spanish junior was the best for showing wot a farce it is

they ignored all rankings and virtuallly just seeded their own players

until there is a defined circuit the players (particularly from the smaller countries)
are open to the politics

guaranteed that the big countries will grab the key seedings, justified in some
cases but in others it will be down solely to trade offs

[TheChosenOneReturns!]

The Spanish Junior was far and away the weakest event on the European Junior circuit, if seedings are based on subjectivity then it would probably be highlighted more in a field of unproven players.

That said the Spaniards medalled in every event, contested 3 finals and took 1 Gold..... so maybe the seedings weren't out by that much!!

[free]

does it really matter how close they got to getting it right

it was subjective and maybe the medalled because the loaded one side of the draw
to make sure their players got thru (apart from wen they win it

the hole point is there should be sum totally fair way to seed a tournamnet for which
players have been training for so long - European juniors

the smaller countries are patheitic for not pushing for this and letting the big countires
do as they like. some of their players only come out at the time of the german junior
having hidden all year and still expect to get seeded (and will do if there country is on
the committee) . who does the seeding?

surely for each event the possible seeds should be put forward, list against this World ranking,
and junior european rankings then base seedings on this . forget all this old pals act about players
who do well in the small closed events such as six nations - these are not available to everyone and
are not fair to be taken in to account. if the big countries choose to play these rather than EBU or senior open tournamnet that is their choice but you can't have it both ways

let's be fair and open

[TheChosenOneReturns!]

Well first of all if there isn't a entirely structured ranking system in place, Id say its quite important that any "subjective" seedings are as accurate as possible, so we don't have people whining about unfair draws!!

The ranking system of course could be improved, but the Spanish draw like any other is submitted to Badminton Europe or the BWF for seedings and draw, so any subjective decisions are probably made their.

Finally not playing the piss poor events and making yourself accountable at the biggest events, i.e. German and Dutch is far from "hiding" if anything id say its the opposite in fact, so we'll just ignore that silly comment.

:D

[free]

the only way to make subjective seeding fair is to make it objective!!!!

by not turning up at events countries weaken the circuit, if the correct structure was in place
and there had to be say 4 events played to get a ranking it would be a lot fairer

say the top Danish boy only plays the German junior and loses to an unseeded Korean early he would
not therefore have any independant results in the year

bet he would still get seeded - but on wot independant basis

chosen one, u seem to want to just leave it to the office staff to sort it out at their discretion. sorry I don't have the same faith in them that you do

[TheChosenOneReturns!]

Eh?

:confused:

You can't make subjective seedings objective numbnuts, hence why it is called "subjective" - influenced by personal opinion and not facts.

[free]

dah!!!!

does that mean you are finally getting the point

there should not be subjective decisions, they should all be objective
based on a fair ranking system

that is my point, get the nominated tournaments set up, or tell players to
play so many world ranking events

sit down and discuss and open and fair way of getting junior rankings sorted
out so that it is not left to the office staff

if four u19 events were nominated in the year, Dutch, German and two others
say, the cost would not be excessive and all players would no to get a ranking
they had to play the mini circuit

[TheChosenOneReturns!]

note to self... should have put this thread in the junior forum.

:p

[free]

agreed

and take it you also agree with the proposal for an open and fair system

would hate to think you were one of the blazer brigade looking to leave yourself
with subjective options if your own players were looking for help with seedings

[TheChosenOneReturns!]

Who started the whole conversation on the inconsistency of the seedings numbnuts?

[Markymark]

Michelle Cheung has withdrawn from the German junior open, so we're not going to get our Sloan v. Cheung showdown!

[TheChosenOneReturns!]

and this opens the draw up for Linda who she was due to play Im guessing?

We will need to see if Frames comments elsewhere on Travers giving the Scottys cannon fodder bares truth.....

Personally, if Linda reaches the quarters or semis of this event, this is a good result.... no cannon fodder here!!

[Markymark]

and opens the draw up for Linda Im guessing?

We will need to see if Frames comments elsewhere on Travers giving the Scottys cannon fodder bares truth.....

Personally, if Linda reaches the quarters or semis of this event, this is a good result.... no cannon fodder here!!

Kieran Merriless isn't cannon fodder, Thomas Bethell isn't, Jillie Cooper isn't, Linda Sloan isn't. There are some great young Scottish juniors.

Linda still has to beat Iris Tabeling from the Netherlands who beat here recently, but she could make the quarters.

[TheChosenOneReturns!]

No no, I was commenting that Frame made the point that Travers is making sure that his players are playing against Cannon Fodder...

[Markymark]

No no, I was commenting that Frame made the point that Travers is making sure that his players are playing against Cannon Fodder...

Frame thinks the other players are cannon fodder? Dear oh dear.

[Frame]

reading to much into it - but i'm wrong Sloan and Merrilees seem decent players looking at results

[TheChosenOneReturns!]

reading to much into it - but i'm wrong Sloan and Merrilees seem decent players looking at results

But they are Scottys so they will be pooped out by 20 anyway.

:D

[Frame]

Mmmm just seen results - maybe I was right about cannon fodder or is that the stuff that comes out Dan Travers ears ?

[TheChosenOneReturns!]

Im getting confused here, me and Marky both, can you clarify Frame what you are on about?

The Scottys themselves are cannon fodder

or

Travers only lets the Scottys play against cannon fodder

:confused:

[Frame]

I doubt if Dan Travers could arrange his players to play against cannon fodder anywhere as he is not capable of telling a good player from a bad player ! Other than one or two good players who he stumbled across the rest are cannon fodder.

[TheChosenOneReturns!]

Im liking you more and more Frame, thanks for the clarification.

:D :D