BBC Badminton coverage-the voice of the BBC

[juniorbadmintonplayer]

I emailed the BBc asking about badminton coverage and asking why it was so poo etc. Here is the reply received.Any comments would be great.

Dear Rishi

Thank you for your e-mail. Please accept our apologies for the delay in
replying. We know our correspondents appreciate a quick response and
we are sorry you have had to wait on this occasion.

I am sorry that you are unhappy with the amount of coverage devoted to
badminton on BBC television. We try to give a wide range of sporting
activities as much airtime as we can, and offer more range than other
networked stations in this country. However, a number of major events take
place at the same time and this, combined with the sheer variety of
sports, makes it impossible for us to schedule coverage which will satisfy
all the main audience groups - including of course those who dislike
sport totally.

Please be assured that your comments have been noted and made available
to our programme makers and senior management. Viewers' opinions are
an invaluable source of feedback for future programme decision-making.

Thank you again for taking the time to contact the BBC.

Regards

Naomh Cooper
BBC Information

[coops241180]

does anybody know what the legal implications of setting up a website simply to allow people add their names to a petition to send to the bbc (and also send a generic email to the bbc each time a name is added to the list)
are? i'm fed up of there not being any badminton on TV - i'm going to write to the BAofE and get an advery put in the magazine and petition every Club i can get in contact with by email to put the website address on their website so that we get a huge list of names and so that the BBC takes some notice.

anybody think i could get in trouble for this?

[Grover]

Do it Neil, you won't get in trouble, maybe you will be unpopular with a few people but try it. All your ideas are good however the generic mail to the BBC may cause you problems and the BBC would ultimately get your site shut down taking away any good press you had.

[rachyuk]

There seems to be certain criteria that the Press/TV coverage people look for in a sport. Badminton obviously doesn't cut it for them!

The BBC letter printed here is a typical responce. They see Badminton as a minority sport with little money, little personality and few sponsors etc...

To comment on the idea of 'barage emailing'. I'd be very careful and make sure you only use email addresses of people who are happy to be included. You don't want to infringe the data protection act or push the TV companies into a corner. Keep it professional and above board and you'll stand a better chance of getting your point across and give them no reason to have your sites shut down.

Thing is Neil, the bottom line is that we'll never see extensive TV coverage in this country, until we have some champions or world beaters from this side of the globe.

[juniorbadmintonplayer]

arghh jus noticed in my original post where it says poo it should say POOR!

[Grover]

Funny though, it amused me:)

[rachyuk]

I think Poo is much better! Made me giggle too!

[khaw]

I totally agree with Rachel, especially her last paragraph "until we have some champions or world beaters from this side of the globe" no commercial company in the UK will be prepared to offer large sum of money for the winning foreign players to scoop the prize money. If we could produce a world champion, I am sure things will be different, every one wants to jump into the band wagon; TV companies will be fighting to view the matches live and big commercial company will then pour money in to advertise their products.

Why can't we produce a world champion? It is our way of life in the UK - the social life and distractions which most of our young top badminton are attracted to. Please don't get me wrong, we do have some very talented young players who are fully committed to the game and have sacrifised substantially in many ways. The Badminton Association of England must be able to spot these youngsters, encourage them in every way and develope their talent to the full.

A Japanese official once asked me, "Why are the Chinese, the Malaysian and the Indonesians are so good in badminton?"

I replied,"If you take a donkey to a race horse trainer, what does it come out? A donkey. But if you take a race horse to a race trainer, what does it come out? A race horse. In other words, we must find a first class race horse for us to win the Derby or the Oaks.

We need to look for young players with a big heart, determination, fighting spirit and killer instinct. I am convinced no badminton coach in this world can teach any child these qualities. A child either has got these or hasn't got these.

My background: Ex-Malaysian International, 35 years coaching in Wimbledon Badminton Club, helped to coach Ray Stevens (won English Natinal title 5 times) currently coaching Eleanor Cox (won 4 Gold Medals in the Home Countries Under 15, won 3 Gold Medals in the English National Under 15, won English National Under 17 Feb. 2003, won European Under 17, won Wimbledon Under 19, won Hampshire Open Nov.2002). I won a Gold Medal in the Veteran Men's Singles and a Bronze Medal in the Men'd Doubles Open Event for Great Britain in the World Police and Fire Games 1995 in Melbourne.

[rachyuk]

Benny,

Some creditials there....just a few podium appearances then!

In your opinion, what would be a good age to start a child in Badminton to see if they develop the 'heart and passion' you describe?

Also, do you think that 'Badminton in Schools' in the UK has any impact on our current junior results or is it just a fluke that we have some very talented players who came to badminton because their parents or a relative plays??

[khaw]

Thanks for your response.

I am convinced "Badminton in Schools" will encourage more children to play the game and in order to create interests, Inter House Tournament should be organised in Schools and as well as Inter Schools Tournament. England "talent scouts" should be invited to all the Tournament finals. I believe the "scouts" are appointed by the England Badminton Association in all areas of the country. I am sure this will help the England "talent scouts" to do their job more effectively. Undoubtedly, the "scouts" will invite the talented children to turn up for trials in the World Class Start Programme. This itself is a wonderful encouragement to the children and give them the incentive to train harder.

As regards your question of "starting age", in my opinion and with my coaching experiences in England, this should be divided into 4 groups. Beginners group 5 years old to 7 years old; elementary group 8 years old to 10 years old; intermediate group 10 years to 12 years and advanced group 13 years old to 15 years. In this way, we have a pyramid system to aim at a five year plan for some of these talented children to reach a World Class Junior standard.

A point I wish to raise is that we must produce more experienced coaches who had been playing at International level so that they can impart their knowledge, tactical play and psychology of the game to these talented children. As it has been said, "Champion beeeds champion" otherwise we might as well call an eloquent salesman to do the job.

Going to your question of about children with badminton playing parents, I am almost certain it is not a fluke that some of the children have developed into a first class badminton player. In this case, it might well be that those children have got the talent, the burning desire and hungry to get to the top. On the contrary, you may have ex-world champion parents, e.g. Erland Kops of Denmark and Eddy Choong of Malaysia, their children do not play competitive badminton; Eddy(my ex-partner in the Malaysian Open Championship in the early 60) has 4 sons - they don't play badminton. This brings me to the point that the current England Under 17 singles girl champion, Eleanor Cox - no one in her parents side played badminton - yet she is so successful in her badminton tournament results at home and abroad in Europe. Why ? I refer to what I said previously - a child must have talent in relation to determination, the will to win, fighting spirit and killer instinct. These are the ingredients for success.

[pnh]

Back to badminton TV-coverage subject. It seems to me that missing TV live badminton broadcasts is not problem only in UK . The same problem is on the other side of globe, where they really have their "world beaters". Malaysian New Straits Times: "Radio Televisyen Malaysia (RTM) did not telecast live the All-England badminton championships despite obtaining the rights to do so due to an alleged lack of funds." ?!

Personal remark: estonian as I am, I can not understand, why local (national) broadcasters can not manage to show for own people sport no. 1 in country (which badminton nevertheless is in Malaysia, isn't it? At least on of them?). I can not imagine Estonian TV without live broadcasts of major events in cross country skiing (Kristina Smigun, Andrus Veerpalu) or decathlon (Erki Nool). And Estonia certainly is not big and fat country, as you know perhaps.

So, it is still not enough, to have local badminton heroes to see live badminton broadcasts from TV. Malaysian example at least.

Isn't the problem still is a bit wider?

[badmintongroupie]

I do not believe that having a World Champion from any of the UK countries would induce television companies to broadcast live badminton. Just look at tennis. There are two weeks of wall-to-wall tennis for Wimbledon every year and there are no world beaters from the UK. In fact in the ladies event, we struggle to make qualifying!!!! And there are millions of pounds invested in trying to produce a UK tennis champion. (I use the intitals 'UK' because if Wales/Scotland/Ireland produced a world beater we would claim him/her as 'our' champion!

Jo Goode and Simon Archer were world beaters in the mixed doubles but that had no effect!!! Or must it be the Mens World Singles Badminton Champion?

Further to the comments on developing talented juniors - it all goes well until they reach 16 when a decision has to be made whether to pursue A Levels and University or to relinquish full-time education and train full-time.

Most opt for A Levels/University and then the going gets really tough!! Try juggling studying a degree with training and tournament play. At this age it is important to be exposed to international tournaments and this means taking time out from studies and not just a day or two. It can be as much as a week! After that there is catching up of missed notes and lectures.

Unless the player studies at Bath or Loughborough (Centres of Excellence) he/she is out on a limb with regard to training. It will be down to the individual to organise coaching and training for themselves.

All vacation time will be spent training at Milton Keynes. (No time off for good behaviour!!!). And to maintain adequate Lottery funding it is necessary (broadly)to achieve and retain top 30 world ranking!

After all this it is amazing that any player goes the distance!

Don't be deterred - there are several top players who have been through this loop.

[Kal]

Thank goodness Benny Khaw has had the courage to talk of donkeys and racehorses and that NO coach can teach many essential qualities needed in a champion - most are unique and many are 'freaks' (take the 'Thorpedo' for example). I wonder if any of the 'empire building, power mad' mostly male coaches have taken the time to ingest this information.

However, as Lynne Parker states, producing champions doesn't guarantee television coverage.

So who is now going to be brave enough to get themselves a managing agent, possibly cosmetic surgery, be controversial or even downright badly behaved in the nightclubs to get themselves and this sport recognised to the same degree as football or cricket ?????

[rachyuk]

Benny,

Your point about producing more experienced coaches (International level). Do you think that all National and International player have the ability to turn to coaching? Or is it only those players who have a natual ability to 'teach' who could do the job?

Is coaching Badminton something you can teach without having been a national champion?

[khaw]

Firstly, I like to respond to the remarks made by Lynne Parker. Yes, I agree that Jo Goode and Simon Archer were one of the best mixed doubles pairs in the world but realistically, the core of advertisment on TV or any national newspaper is based on the Men's Singles or the Ladies' Singles, may it be tennis or badminton; although men's/ladies' doubles and mixed doubles are more interesting and exciting for spectators to watch. Just look at the prize money for the Wimbledon mens or ladies' singles winner compared to the doubles or mixed doubles winners.

The second point raised by Lynne about the difficulties our children are facing when it comes to doing their homework or studying for their A levels/University. I don't blame the children for having two strings on their bow in chase they decide that badminton will get them no where in life. However, if they could see at the end of the tunnel there will be a few million pounds to pick up if they could become world badminton champions like what the singles players get in tennis, I am convinced our youngsters will start thinking and have a different view about badminton. The bottom line is obviously money. After all who doesn't want money to have the financial security for the rest of their life.

I will now come to what Rachel raised concerning "International players" becoming "teachers". Not all International players can become good teachers e.g. the great Wong Peng Soon of formerly Malaya (now Malaysia) who won the All England Championships title at the age of 37, became the first professional badminton coach in the world. I was one of the 12 youngsters in Malaysia to be selected for coaching with Wong. He lined us up and challenged one of us at a time to play against him. We all got 15-0, 15-0 except my old friend Teh Kew San who got 1 point of him (Teh Kew San and Lim Say Hup won the All England Doubles title in 1959). This proves that a world champion does not necessary can become a first class coach; but some of them may be born teachers who can encourage, motivate and demonstrate well to the children. They are the coaches we want to teach our talented children.

The other point raised by Rachel is "Can anyone teach badminton?" Of cause anyone can but at a lower level like beginners or club level. A lot of people can also learn how to play badminton through books but they cannot become a champion otherwise all who learn through books will be world beaters.

[badmintongroupie]

I would like to return to the subject of promoting badminton through the media. Badminton is not even reported in the national press save for a few singles results now and then and never in the tabloid press which probably has the highest percentage of readership.

If badminton cannot achieve minimal press coverage, what hope is there of television coverage? Kathleen has the right idea - badminton needs a 'John McEnroe!' Badminton tournaments in the UK are silent affairs - making a noise is frowned upon! In a nutshell - there's no razzamatazz! Listen to the Indonesians and the Danes. From junior level the Danes are encouraged to shout,clap and chant even during rallies!

Not so long ago squash had a British world champion in the name of Peter Nichol. Did we see squash promoted on television? No. And he was at the top for several years and he still remains a contender.

And finally, as a nation, badminton has more high world ranked players than tennis. Nathan Robertson and Gail Emms are number two in the world rankings. Imagine if that were an English tennis pair! We also have 2 ladies singles players in the top twenty, two ladies doubles pairs in the top 25 and another mixed pair in the top 20 rankings.

What English badminton doesn't have is a effective promoter!

[Kal]

Perhaps now is the time for a razz ma tazz 'roadshow'. Unfortunately I'm not sure we have any characters in the game in Britain who could go on tour and entertain us. There was a host of 'naughty' boys in the game in the 70/80's all were hugely entertaining and totally unpredictable. They could go on the court in an exhibition and 'show off' their immense talent.

There used to be a guy called Hugh Fogie (I think) who had a badminton circus tour and entertained the crowds with fascinating routines. Even when the Whetnalls broke away to become the first professionals they 'toured' with the most up to date routines and techniques.

The down side today is we are concentrating almost all our efforts on youngsters and the main interest in the game as far as money and support are concerned is in the 30 - 60 category. They are the ones who could finance the road to recovery if we could only promote the game as 'interesting'.

Some guys at work who tend to follow the traditional sports say that the female badminton players should seriously consider make overs to encourage more sport loving males to take an interest.
They thought the game was potentially dynamic but the players totally dull.

[Giggle3]

Sorry Kath but I can't see any sort of roadshow getting badminton noticed - especially by TV. Anyway why worry about TV? Live badminton is best (especially playing!) as you saw at Birmingham where there was some wonderful entertainment on view for those who were prepared to attend.
Get to the World Championships in May and see plenty more of the same! See you there!

[danbelcher]

It's VITALLY important to get badminton on TV. The short term future of mixed doubles has been spared the axe from the olympics but the whole sport is still in danger from being dropped completely. Raising the profile of the sport is paramount and that can only be done by getting it on TV and making our players household names and we have two very marketable players ranked second in the world for a start.

Yes badminton is great live but attendance at the All England was poor and the only way of attracting them in the future is to make people aware it exists. Scoring to 15 is old fashioned and needs revamping and 5x9 is much better suited to TV. The five minute break between second and third games is also dated and scoring to 11 for any event that involves ladies is also ridiculous. This does not help promote the sport in Europe. In Asia they don't need to raise it any higher.

[khaw]

Hi Lynne,

I totally agree with you that the spectators are too quiet in the UK when it comes to watching the game of badminton as compared to the other countries in Asia like Indonesia and Malaysia. I happened to witness the Thomas match in Malaysia one year and I can assure you that anyone sitting next to me could not hear a word even if I tried to shout. At one stage I thought the noise was so loud I could almost feel the ceiling vibrating.

There is a lack of spark when it comes to our spectators trying to urge our players on. Definitely, the shouting and the loud noise would inspire our players a great deal, especially when it comes to the crucial winning point. As a matter of fact, I tried to introduce making loud noise, shouting and doing all sort of things to distract the children concentration during training but the idea was frowned upon by one of the Engligh Schools Badminton Association official during a meeting with other parents - he turned round and said to me, "We don't do this kind of thing in England, we are very civilised you know." In my mind, this man is very short sighted - he is like a frog living in a nut shell.

As regards the like of John McEnroe, I wonder if you are aware that players can now be shown the "yellow card" and "red card" if their behaviour during play is considered unacceptable by the umpire e.g. swearing, throwing the racket due to an unforced error, etc. Therefore, players are now aware of this and will not be acting foolishly to be shown the "yellow card" and "red card" in any major tournament.

As far as loud noise is concerned, everyone present at any tournament in the UK is encouraged to make.

[casey]

The answer is very simple. America, America, America. Until the Americans start to be interested and start to play and produce winners, we will not be seeing much badders on our T.V. screens. Nuff said.

[Kal]

So, instead of constantly inviting over regimented Chinese teams to thrash our national team, let's invite over the American team to the Royal Albert Hall - with their cheerleaders and their promotional expertise. Then we could add guests appearances from some of the stars of the past, present and future for a night to remember which could even be televised !!! Then we could all clap and stamp and misbehave and nobody would produce red cards!! Then lets take it on tour around the regions inviting all sorts of other guests appearances, but please somewhere where the seats are a damn sight more comortable than Birmingham. It was not pleasant couped up in the Gods with a metal bar pressed on your legs for three hours !!!

[RStroud]

Good ideas from Kathleen re road shows and the American team being invited here instead of the insurmountable Chinese. When I was in Oman there was a travelling tennis circus (Peter Burwash International, I think) which came to hotels in all the Gulf States and had a lot of audience participation and was great fun. Have participation events been tried in shopping malls with sticky tape for lines and plenty of clearance? Would need a bit of organisation but shouldn't be beyond the wit of a County or keen large club/centre - and the shopping mall administration might be quite keen for something different to be happening on a Saturday!

Re more TV coverage for the bigger tournaments, I think one argument we should be putting forward to BBC/Sky etc is that badminton (I read somewhere) is chosen by more students as an option for GCSE PE than any other sport! Just think about that. If true, it is extremely significant and one we should be shouting loud about. (Factors such as boys and girls can play together, that it's warmer inside(!)and that badminton is "easy"(!)probably contribute to this statistic). I believe there is a quiet revolution going on out there with more and more children/young people playing badminton in (mainly) secondary schools - usually at a low level, since this popularity probably hasn't yet registered in colleges and universities which train our PE teachers. I coach in one secondary school where badminton is incredibly popular but the PE teachers don't feel that confident about the game and only teach at a basic level - even though the PE staff are badminton friendly and extremely co-operative. I am now trying to help train them and point them towards courses. (If any coaches are out there with a bit of time on their hands there is probably a school nearby which would welcome you with open arms!)

It is this rapidly growing popularity in schools which we need to capitalise on and if anyone from the BAofE is reading this, can more be done (armed with the right stats) to train PE/non PE teachers - both current and in training? Awareness certainly needs raising in higher education where our teachers are trained. Also, again armed with the right stats, what about ensuring that badminton is in the front of the queue for grant aid and general sports/educational recognition for individual sports in the various schemes that are set up from time to time?

With a higher profile brought about by more interest in the sport in schools, our arguments for increased coverage might resonate louder with the media.

[Pglews]

I agree whole-heartedly with Lynne Parker's point about English badminton being far too quiet. Back home in Shropshire (and no doubt its the case in other counties) county restricted finals are haunted affairs. People talk silently if at all and applaud in between points?!??! Whats that about!! We even had a complaint when noise was made during a university league match this year!!
Our mentality towards the sport is wrong, because people think of it in the same way as tennis (I can't prove this, but I'm sure if we set up a survey then the association would probably be made by the general public). The All England atmosphere provided by the Malaysian, Indonesian and Danish fans mainly is better than a football match sometimes! We need to show this to people and open them up to it, rather than being typically British and living in our shells!
Simon Archer had some venom in him, hopefully still has...market it! Nathan Robertson has known to be a controversial from time to time...market that! Its just a shame Johnathan Lewis doesn't seem to be around anymore. Having seen him play at a Grand Slam he was hardly the umpire's best friend, but good entertainment and very naturally gifted as well.
Also, singles in badminton seems to be promoted in very much the same way as tennis...i.e. as the flagship of the sport. Doubles is faster, the fans are louder and more involved and this is the side of badminton that needs to be shown to the public. Surely the BAofE has some sort of marketing initiative towards badminton....or someone...anyone somewhere, because the positive sides to badminton need to be shown. Singles is getting faster and more accesible, but a long rallying game where the players are trying to wear each other down with clears and drops might not appeal to general viewers. On the other hand shuttles whizzing about at over 100 miles per hour on a regular basis and explosive smashing accompanied by an army of fans yelling in time with them might just get people's attention?!?!?
Also having done some experimentation with a video camera at a badminton match, shots from overhead don't allow the viewer to see the true velocity of a smash, or the explosiveness of the player's footwork. Nearer the court, but from say a diagonal point (to capture most of the action) would be a good position to film from, as it shows up the pace of play a lot better.
On a final point, McEnroe played a lot of exhibition tournaments in his time, with the likes of Borg and his good mate Vitas Gerulatis. Maybe a few more exhibition games being set up in public venues would get more attention?

[johng]

In response to Rogers comment about participation events being put on in shopping centres, our local league (Milton Keynes) has done this for a number of years ....laying out a number of courts in the main hall at the milton Keynes Regional Shopping Centre, on busy shopping days. Iinvited International players and coaches have played and given advice

The League club players also play a fun..but serious series of games and the general public invited to have a hit.

Do not know if this has happened in last couple of years but 3 or 4 were held in the preceeding years.

And No..this did not happen because the BAof E are based in milton Keynes...It happened because the League organisers decide to make it happen..all credit to them

[badmintongroupie]

Hi Bennie

I used 'John McEnroe'as an example of a 'character' in sport. I am aware of the card system but badminton in England needs a few controversial participants. This always makes the public sit up and take notice - even if it's for the wrong reasons!

I watched the BBC showing of the All England this afternoon and was bored rigid! And I understand the game and it's tactics! The commentary was awful -so dull and no explanation of the different tactics and techniques required for singles and doubles play.
And no explanation of the various changes in the scoring system. Anyone who watched last year's broadcast and saw 5 games to 7 must have been totally confused with games to 15 and 11 points. But credit to the BBC for making an effort.

Most spectators at live badminton events are already converted to badminton. What is needed is to attract those who know very little about the game.

[Kal]

I will be interested to get the views of my 'non-converted' colleagues at work tomorrow to see if they were inspired by the BBC coverage this afternoon.
Whoever put the package together certainly did a better job than last year when they showed a ten minute section of 'pit-pat' with Simon Archer and a Blue Peter presenter - putting the ideal of the sport being dynamic and explosive back 20 years !!
Steve Baddeley was succinct and Kelly Morgan 'looked' good but her commentary compared to the experience of Gill Clark was to say the least uninspiring.
The (Danish?)Performance Director's interview should have been cut and more time devoted to the play in mixed and ladies doubles, but as you say Lynne, credit to the BBC for making an effort. There were good flashbacks to the crowd enthusiasm of the Commonwealth Games and many good shots of the crowd enjoying and being involved in supporting the games in Birmingham.

They did say they would be there to cover the World Championships - could they mean all week !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[NeilNicholls]

We should forget the BBC. It might be easier to persuade Channel 4 or Five that there is an un-tapped viewing market out here for Badminton.